Responsa for Bava Metzia 133:16
עבד רב אשי עובדא ביתומים קטנים
Rabbah son of R. Huna said: Whenever one says, 'You and Nawla are relatives,' he [the vendor] relies upon it, and does not completely transfer it [the object of sale].<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Hence the sale is conditional, and the field can always be redeemed. ');"><sup>16</sup></span> Now, the land is [certainly] returnable; but what of the crops?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Raised after the sale. ');"><sup>17</sup></span> Is it as direct usury, which can be legally reclaimed;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since such a sale is really a loan (v. Mishnah on 65b), the crops which the purchaser enjoys are in the nature of direct interest. ');"><sup>18</sup></span> or perhaps it is only indirect<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. supra, 61b. ');"><sup>19</sup></span> usury, and cannot be reclaimed? — Rabbah b. Rab said: It stands to reason that it is considered indirect usury and cannot be reclaimed in court. And thus did Raba say, It is considered indirect usury and cannot be reclaimed in court. Abaye inquired of Rabbah: What of a mortgage?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' If a field was mortgaged and no stipulation made about its crops, and the creditor took them. ');"><sup>20</sup></span> Is the reason there [in the previous case] that he made no stipulation? Then here too there was no stipulation!<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Hence it is not returnable. ');"><sup>21</sup></span> Or, perhaps, there it is a sale, but here a loan? — He replied: The reason there is that no stipulation was made; so here too there was no stipulation. R. papi said: Rabina gave a practical decision, calculated [the value of] the crops, and ordered it to be returned, thus disagreeing with Rabbah son of R. Huna. Mar,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Var. lec.: Raba. ');"><sup>22</sup></span> the son of R. Joseph, said in Raba's name: With reference to a mortgage: Where it is customary to make [the creditor] quit [whenever the loan is repaid],<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And until then, he is in possession and enjoys its usufruct. ');"><sup>23</sup></span> if he took the usufruct to the amount of the loan, he must quit it;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., if the debtor makes the claim, the usufruct is counted as repayment, and the creditor has no further title. ');"><sup>24</sup></span> but if in excess thereof, [the surplus] is not returnable;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Because it is not direct interest. ');"><sup>25</sup></span> nor is one loan<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'bond.' ');"><sup>26</sup></span> balanced against another.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., if the debtor owes him more money on another bond, the excess cannot be deducted from it. ');"><sup>27</sup></span> But when it [the mortgaged estate] belongs to orphans, if he [the creditor] enjoyed its usufruct to the amount of the loan, he must quit it; if it [the usufruct] exceeded it, [the surplus] is returnable, and one loan is balanced against another. R. Ashi said: Now that you rule, If the usufruct exceeded the loan, [the balance] is not returnable; then even if it [merely] equalled it, he must not be dismissed without payment. Why? Because to dismiss him without payment is tantamount to making him return [what he has already had]; whereas it is only indirect interest, which is not reclaimable at law. R. Ashi gave a practical decision in reference to orphans [minors],
Teshuvot Maharam
A. If one lends money on condition that he share in the profits but not in the losses, the terms of this transaction, being unlawful, are void. We must, therefore, substitute other terms in their place. We must choose one of the following alternatives: a) the transaction is a pure loan bearing no profit; b) the lender is liable for his share of the losses and is entitled to his share of the profits. Since a person lends money with the intention of earning a profit, and such profit constitutes the main purpose of the transaction, we prefer the second alternative. Therefore, we must calculate what percentage of the entire profit (earned by A through the use of the ten pounds) the three pounds per year was expected to form, and, then, charge the charity-chest with the responsibility for the same percentage of the losses. If, during the ten year period, the thirty pounds paid by A exceeded the percentage of the total profit, A is entitled to deduct such excess from the principal; otherwise, he must repay the entire principal.
R. Hayyim b. Machir raised objections to R. Meir's decision. He brought proof to the effect that the transaction ought to be changed into a pure loan bearing no profit, and that A be entitled to retain the ten pounds of the principal against the illegal profit he has paid. He even cited (by number) another Responsum of R. Meir wherein the latter decided that a transaction such as the above be considered a pure loan bearing no profit. (Cf. Cr. 62, Pr. 151; Am. II, 169.) He assured Rabbi Meir, however, that he would follow his decision.
R. Meir replied: I was always of the opinion that the aforesaid transaction ought to be considered a pure loan bearing no profit. But, when your query reached me I had just received the book (Code) of Maimomides, and I decided to "ask the Oracle" (see what Maimonides says on the subject). When I discovered that Maimonides requires the lender to share in the losses as well as in the profits, I adopted his view. For all his words are based on tradition. Even if this decision be based on reason, I have to bow to his opinion since my inferior reasoning ability could never compare with that of Maimonides who is a profound master in that art. Moreover, I see the wisdom of his view. For a person who lends money to another does so because he hopes to profit thereby. Were he mainly interested in the safety of the principal (as you seem to infer) he would keep the money in a safe place and never lend it to anybody. Were we to ask a lender who had stipulated that he do not share in the losses, whether he would prefer to change his voided agreement into a pure loan transaction bearing no profit, or choose to share in the profits and the losses, he would certainly prefer the latter. Furthermore, when the active partner lends the money against adequate security, the chances of earning a profit are much greater than the chances of losing part of the principal.
SOURCES: L. 426; P. 477.
Teshuvot Maharam
A. If one lends money on condition that he share in the profits but not in the losses, the terms of this transaction, being unlawful, are void. We must, therefore, substitute other terms in their place. We must choose one of the following alternatives: a) the transaction is a pure loan bearing no profit; b) the lender is liable for his share of the losses and is entitled to his share of the profits. Since a person lends money with the intention of earning a profit, and such profit constitutes the main purpose of the transaction, we prefer the second alternative. Therefore, we must calculate what percentage of the entire profit (earned by A through the use of the ten pounds) the three pounds per year was expected to form, and, then, charge the charity-chest with the responsibility for the same percentage of the losses. If, during the ten year period, the thirty pounds paid by A exceeded the percentage of the total profit, A is entitled to deduct such excess from the principal; otherwise, he must repay the entire principal.
R. Hayyim b. Machir raised objections to R. Meir's decision. He brought proof to the effect that the transaction ought to be changed into a pure loan bearing no profit, and that A be entitled to retain the ten pounds of the principal against the illegal profit he has paid. He even cited (by number) another Responsum of R. Meir wherein the latter decided that a transaction such as the above be considered a pure loan bearing no profit. (Cf. Cr. 62, Pr. 151; Am. II, 169.) He assured Rabbi Meir, however, that he would follow his decision.
R. Meir replied: I was always of the opinion that the aforesaid transaction ought to be considered a pure loan bearing no profit. But, when your query reached me I had just received the book (Code) of Maimomides, and I decided to "ask the Oracle" (see what Maimonides says on the subject). When I discovered that Maimonides requires the lender to share in the losses as well as in the profits, I adopted his view. For all his words are based on tradition. Even if this decision be based on reason, I have to bow to his opinion since my inferior reasoning ability could never compare with that of Maimonides who is a profound master in that art. Moreover, I see the wisdom of his view. For a person who lends money to another does so because he hopes to profit thereby. Were he mainly interested in the safety of the principal (as you seem to infer) he would keep the money in a safe place and never lend it to anybody. Were we to ask a lender who had stipulated that he do not share in the losses, whether he would prefer to change his voided agreement into a pure loan transaction bearing no profit, or choose to share in the profits and the losses, he would certainly prefer the latter. Furthermore, when the active partner lends the money against adequate security, the chances of earning a profit are much greater than the chances of losing part of the principal.
SOURCES: L. 426; P. 477.