Talmud Bavli
Talmud Bavli

Menachot 209

CommentaryAudioShareBookmark
1

תחלה

first; and if 'of the flock', he should have to bring a lamb<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And not a goat.');"><sup>1</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
2

מן הצאן יביא כבש הואיל ופתח בו הכתוב תחלה

since Holy Writ stated that first; and if 'of the birds', he should have to bring turtle-doves,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And not young pigeons.');"><sup>2</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
3

מן העוף יביא תורים הואיל ופתח בו הכתוב תחלה

since Holy Writ stated them first.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
4

אלמה תנן הרי עלי עולה יביא כבש רבי אלעזר בן עזריה אומר תור או בן יונה ולא פליג רבי יהודה

Wherefore then have we learnt: [If a man said,] 'I take upon myself to bring a burnt-offering', he should bring a lamb; but R'Eleazar B'Azariah says, [He may bring] a turtledove or a young pigeon?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Infra 107a.');"><sup>3</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
5

אלא מאי מיוחדת שבמנחות דלית ליה שם לווי

And R'Judah does not differ there! - We must therefore say that it is accounted the principal meal-offering because it has no descriptive name.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The meal-offering of fine flour is invariably referred to as 'the meal-offering', whereas the others have a descriptive name attached to them, as the meal-offering prepared on a griddle, or in a pan, or baked in the oven.');"><sup>4</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
6

והא תנא הואיל ופתח בו הכתוב תחלה קאמר הכי קאמר איזהו מנחה מיוחדת שבמנחות דלית ליה שם לווי זו שפתח בו הכתוב תחלה

But the Tanna gave as the reason 'Because Holy Writ stated it first'! - This is what he meant to say.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
7

פשיטא מנחת הסולת קאמר סימנא בעלמא:

Which is the meal-offering described as 'the principal one' by virtue of the fact that it has no descriptive name?

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
8

מנחה מין המנחה [וכו']: בעי רב פפא מיני מנחה מהו

It is that which Holy Writ stated first.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Namely, the meal-offering of fine flour.');"><sup>5</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
9

כיון דאמר מיני תרתי קאמר ומאי מנחה דכולה מנחות נמי מנחה מיקריין דכתיב (ויקרא ז, א) וזאת תורת המנחה

But this is obvious, for [R'Judah] expressly mentioned the meal-offering of fine flour! - It is merely stated as a mnemonical sign.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The Tanna of the Baraitha gave us a further help as an aid to the memory in order to remember that the principal meal-offering is the meal-offering of fine flour.');"><sup>6</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
10

או דלמא כיון דאמר מנחה חדא מנחה קאמר ומאי מיני מנחה הכי קאמר ממיני מנחה חדא מנחה עלי

[IF HE SAID,] 'A MEAL-OFFERING' OR 'A KIND OF MEAL-OFFERING' etc. R'Papa raised the following question.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
11

תא שמע מנחה מין מנחה יביא אחת הא מיני מנחה שתים

What if he said 'kinds of meal-offering'?

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
12

אימא סיפא מנחות מין מנחות יביא שתים הא מיני מנחה חדא אלא מהא ליכא למשמע מינה:

[Shall I say that] since he said 'kinds!.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In the plural.');"><sup>7</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
13

תא שמע מין מנחות עלי יביא שתי מנחות ממין אחד הא ממיני מנחה חדא

he obviously meant two, and the term 'meal-offering' [is generic], since all meal-offerings are referred to as 'meal-offering as it is written, And this is the law of the meal-offering?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lev. VI, 7.');"><sup>8</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
14

דלמא הא מיני מנחה מביא שתי מנחות משני מינין

Or [shall I rather say that] since he said 'meal-offering'<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In the singular.');"><sup>9</sup></span>

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
15

והא לא תני הכי מין מנחות עלי מביא שתי מנחות ממין אחד מיני מנחות עלי מביא שתי מנחות משני מינין הא מיני מנחה חדא

he meant only one meal-offering, and by the expression 'kinds of meal-offering' he meant to imply, 'Of the kinds of meal-offering I take upon myself [to bring] one meal-offering'? - Come and hear: [IF HE SAID,] 'A MEAL-OFFERING' OR 'A KIND OF MEAL-OFFERING', HE MUST BRING ONE [OF ANY KIND].

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
16

דלמא הא מני רבי שמעון היא דאמר מחצה חלות ומחצה רקיקין יביא ומאי מיני מנחה מנחה דאית בה תרי מיני

It follows, however, that [if he said] 'kinds of meal-offering' he would have to bring two! - Read the next clause: IF MEAL-OFFERINGS' OR 'A KIND OF MEAL-OFFERINGS', HE MUST BRING TWO.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
17

אבל רבנן דאמרי מחצה חלות ומחצה רקיקין לא יביא מביא שתי מנחות משני מינין:

It follows, however, that [if he said] 'kinds of meal-offering' he would have to bring only one! The truth is that we cannot decide from here.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
18

פירשתי ואיני יודע מה פירשתי יביא חמשתן: מאן תנא

Come and hear: [If he said,] 'I take upon myself to bring a kind of meal-offerings', he must bring two meal-offerings of the same kind.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
19

אמר רבי ירמיה דלא כרבי שמעון דאי רבי שמעון כיון דאמר מחצה חלות ומחצה רקיקין יביא

It follows, however, that [if he said] 'kinds of mealoffering' he would only have to bring one! - Perhaps the inference is this: [if he said] 'kinds of meal-offering', he must bring two meal-offerings of two kinds.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
20

אי נמי סבר לה כר' יהודה דאמר כל המנחות באות עשר איכא לספוקה בארבע עשרה מנחות

But it has been taught otherwise: [If he said,] 'I take upon myself to bring a kind of meal-offerings', he must bring two meal-offerings of the same kind.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
21

אביי אמר אפילו תימא רבי שמעון שמעינן ליה לרבי שמעון דאמר מייתי ומתני

But if he said, 'I take upon myself to bring kinds of meal-offerings', he must bring two meal-offerings of two kinds.

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
22

דתניא רבי שמעון אומר למחרת מביא אשמו ולוגו

If follows from this, that [if he said] 'kinds of meal-offering' he would have to bring only one! - Perhaps that [Baraitha] represents the view of R'Simeon who ruled that one may bring it<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Sc. the meal-offering baked in the oven; v. supra 63a.');"><sup>10</sup></span> the half in cakes and the half in wafers; accordingly the expression 'kinds of meal-offering' refers to that meal-offering which may be of two kinds. According to the Rabbis, however, who ruled that one may not bring it the half in cakes and the half in wafers, he would then have to bring two meal-offerings of two kinds.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For the fulfilment of the expression 'kinds of meal-offering'.');"><sup>11</sup></span> [IF HE SAID,] 'I SPECIFIED [A CERTAIN KIND] BUT I DO NOT KNOW WHAT KIND I SPECIFIED'. HE MUST BRING THE FIVE KINDS. Who is the Tanna that taught this?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' That because of the doubt he must bring the five kinds of meal-offerings.');"><sup>12</sup></span> - R'Jeremiah said, It is not R'Simeon; for according to R'Simeon who stated that he may bring it the half in cakes and the half in wafers,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., the meal-offering baked in the oven must consist of ten pieces, but it may be made up partly of cakes and partly of wafers. v. supra 63a.');"><sup>13</sup></span> even though R'Judah's view were accepted, that all meal-offerings consisted of ten cakes each,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' As opposed to R. Meir's view that all meal-offerings must consist of twelve pieces each. V. supra 76a.');"><sup>14</sup></span> he would have to bring fourteen meal-offerings because of the doubt.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For he would have to bring the eleven possible variations of the baked meal-offering, viz., ten cakes and no wafers, nine cakes and one wafer, eight cakes and two wafers, seven cakes and three wafers... no cakes and ten wafers, plus the three other kinds of meal-offering, a total of fourteen meal-offerings. According to R. Meir there are thirteen variations of the baked meal-offering, beginning with twelve cakes and no wafers, and so the total would be sixteen.');"><sup>15</sup></span> Abaye said. You may even say that it is R'Simeon, for we have heard R'Simeon express the view that one may bring an offering and make conditions about it.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And therefore, in the case of our Mishnah, he would only have to bring one baked meal-offering of ten cakes and one of ten wafers (in addition, of course, to the other three kinds of meal-offering) and declare, 'If I had specified to bring it all in cakes, or all in wafers, then let the cakes or the wafers be offered in fulfilment of my vow and the others be a freewill-offering; and if I had specified to bring it partly in cakes and partly in wafers, then let that number of each kind which I had specified be offered in fulfilment of my vow and the rest be offered as a freewill-offering'.');"><sup>16</sup></span> For it has been taught:<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Tosef. Neziruth VI. The case dealt with is that of a Nazirite who was in doubt whether he was rendered unclean or not and also whether he ,rjnk was still a confirmed leper or not; and the Tanna of the Baraitha rules that he may eat consecrated food after sixty days. V. Tosaf s.v. .');"><sup>17</sup></span> R'Simeon says. On the following day<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' After sixty days have elapsed. Cf. Naz. 59b.');"><sup>18</sup></span> he brings his guilt-offering and a log [of oil]

ResourcesAsk RabbiCopyNotesHighlightBookmarkSharePlay
Previous ChapterNext Chapter