Niddah 78

Chapter 78

א ואמר רב יהודה אמר שמואל ל"ש אלא ט"ו לטבילתה שהן כ"ב לראייתה
1 And in connection with this Rab Judah citing Samuel stated: This<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. supra p. 272, n. 4. ');"><sup>1</sup></span>
ב ושינתה ליום כ"ז דכי הדרי ואתו עשרין ותרתי קיימא לה בתוך ימי זיבתה וקתני זה וזה אסורין אלמא דחיישינן לה
2 
ג וקסבר רב פפא עשרין ותרתין מעשרין ותרתין מנינן נדה ופתחה מעשרין וז' מנינן
3 was learnt only [when she was accustomed to observe a flow] on the fifteenth day after her ritual immersion,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Which is performed at the conclusion of the seven days' period of menstruation. ');"><sup>2</sup></span> which is the twenty-second day<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The seven days of menstruation (cf. prev. n.) plus the fifteen days. ');"><sup>3</sup></span>
ד א"ל רב הונא בריה דרב יהושע לרב פפא ממאי דלמא עשרין ותרתין נמי מעשרין וז' מנינן דכי הדרי ואתו עשרין ותרתין קיימא לה בתוך ימי נדותה
4 after her observation of her discharge, and it was changed to the twenty-seventh day<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' After her discharge. ');"><sup>4</sup></span> so that when the twenty-second day<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since the day on which the discharge should have appeared. ');"><sup>5</sup></span> comes round again she is well within the days of her <i>zibah</i> period,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' There being only (22 — 5 =) 17 days since her last discharge on the twenty-seventh. The seventeenth day, (the last of the seven days of menstruation and the ten of the eleven days of zibah) is obviously within the zibah period. ');"><sup>6</sup></span>
ה וה"נ מסתברא דאי לא תימא הכי האי תרנגולתא דרמיא יומא וכבשה יומא ורמיא יומא וכבשה יומא וכבשה תרי יומי ורמיא חד יומא
5 and yet it was stated that intercourse was forbidden on both days. It is thus clear that the possibility of a regular period<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Even on a day in the zibah period. ');"><sup>7</sup></span> must be taken into consideration.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. supra p. 272, n. 12. ');"><sup>8</sup></span>
ו כי הדרה נקטה כדלקמיה נקטה או כדמעיקרא נקטה על כרחך כדלקמיה נקטה
6 R. Papa is thus<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since he regards the twenty-second day as one of the days of the zibah period. ');"><sup>9</sup></span>
ז א"ל רב פפא אלא הא דאמר ר"ל אשה קובעת לה וסת בתוך ימי זיבתה ואין אשה קובעת לה וסת בתוך ימי נדותה ורבי יוחנן אמר אשה קובעת לה וסת בתוך ימי נדותה ה"ד
7 of the opinion that the twenty-two days<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' On which intercourse was forbidden. ');"><sup>10</sup></span> are reckoned from the twenty-second day<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Sc. the days on which formerly the discharge usually made its appearance and not from the twenty-seventh day. ');"><sup>11</sup></span> while the beginning of the menstruation and <i>zibah</i> period<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' At the conclusion of the menstruation period, seven days later. ');"><sup>12</sup></span> is reckoned from the twenty-seventh day.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The day on which the discharge last appeared. The twenty-second day after the twenty-second is only the seventeenth day after the twenty-seventh (cf. prev. n. but five). ');"><sup>13</sup></span>
ח לאו כגון דחזאי ריש ירחא וחמשא בירחא וריש ירחא וחמשא בירחא והשתא חזאי בחמשא בירחא ובריש ירחא לא חזאי
8 Said R. Huna son of R. Joshua to R. Papa: Whence do you draw your ruling? Is it not possible that the twenty-second day also is reckoned from the twenty-seventh day,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' On which the discharge last appeared. ');"><sup>14</sup></span>
ט וקאמר אשה קובעת לה וסת בתוך ימי נדותה אלמא מריש ירחא מנינא
9 so that when the twenty-second day comes round again the woman is within the days of her menstruation period?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The twenty-two days consisting of 7 (menstruation) + 11 (zibah) + 4 (of the seven of the present menstruation period) days. ');"><sup>15</sup></span>
י א"ל לא הכי א"ר יוחנן כגון דחזאי ריש ירחא וריש ירחא ועשרין וחמשה בירחא וריש ירחא דאמרינן דמי יתירי הוא דאתוספו בה
10 And this<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' That the reckoning should begin from the day of the last discharge rather than from the day on which the discharge should have appeared. ');"><sup>16</sup></span> is also logical. For if you do not admit this,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' That the reckoning should begin from the day of the last discharge rather than from the day on which the discharge should have appeared. ');"><sup>16</sup></span> consider the case of a<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., '(what about) that'. ');"><sup>17</sup></span>
יא וכן כי אתא רבין וכל נחותי ימא אמרוה כרב הונא בריה דרב יהושע
11 hen that laid eggs on alternate days<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'that lays on a day and holds back on (the next) day' (bis). ');"><sup>18</sup></span>
יב <br><br><big><strong>הדרן עלך בנות כותים</strong></big><br><br>
12 and once ceased laying for two days and again laid on the following day. When it reverts to its former habit,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Laying on alternate days. ');"><sup>19</sup></span> does it do so in accordance with the present<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'as before it', i.e., laying on alternate days beginning with the last day (the sixth in the case submitted) refraining on the seventh and laying again on the eighth, and so on. ');"><sup>20</sup></span> or in accordance with the past?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'as originally', i.e., alternating with the day on which laying should have taken place (the fifth in the case submitted), thus laying on both the seventh as well as the sixth. ');"><sup>21</sup></span> You have no alternative but to admit that it would do it in accordance with the present.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since alternation with the day on which laying should have taken place would only result (cf. prev. n.) in a new disturbance of the regularity (laying on two consecutive days). Similarly, in the case of the woman, a reversion to her regular periods can only be effected by counting the days from the one on which her discharge last appeared, viz., from the twenty-seventh day. ');"><sup>22</sup></span> Said R. Papa to him: With reference, however, to what Resh Lakish ruled, 'A woman may establish for herself a settled period during the days of her <i>zibah</i> but not during the days of her menstruation' and to what R. Johanan ruled, 'A woman may establish for herself a settled period during the days of her menstruation', is not one to understand this as being a case,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'how is one to imagine, not?' ');"><sup>23</sup></span> for instance, where she observed a discharge on the first day of the month, on the fifth of the month and again on the first of the second month and on the fifth of that month, and finally<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'and now'. ');"><sup>24</sup></span> she observed a discharge on the fifth of the month while on the first of that month she observed none? And yet it was stated that 'a woman may establish for herself a settled period during the days of her menstruation'. It thus clearly follows<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since the fifth day of the month is regarded as of the 'days of her menstruation'. ');"><sup>25</sup></span> that we reckon the days from the first day of the month?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Though on that day no discharge had appeared. From which it follows that the counting of the days begins from the day on which the discharge should have appeared and not from that on which it appeared the last time. ');"><sup>26</sup></span> — No, the other replied, it is this that R. Johanan meant: A woman, for instance, who observed a discharge on the first day of the month, on the first day of the next month and on the twenty-fifth of that month, and on the first day of the following month, in which case we presume that<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The reason why the discharge made its appearance on the twenty-fifth day of the second month and not on the first day of the following month. ');"><sup>27</sup></span> she experienced an influx of additional blood.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And, as a result, the discharge whose regular time of appearance was still the first of the month made its appearance a little earlier. The first day of the month being within seven days from the twenty-fifth of the previous month (on which the discharge appeared) may well be described as within the days of menstruation. ');"><sup>28</sup></span> So also Rabin and all seafarers, when they came,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' From Palestine to Babylon. ');"><sup>29</sup></span> reported the tradition<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Of R. Johanan. ');"><sup>30</sup></span> in agreement with the explanation of R. Huna son of R. Joshua.