Pesachim 147

מתני׳ <big><strong>כיצד</strong></big> צולין את הפסח מביאין שפוד של רמון ותוחבו לתוך פיו עד בית נקובתו ונותן את כרעיו ואת בני מעיו לתוכו דברי ר' יוסי הגלילי ר"ע אומר כמין בישול הוא זה אלא תולין חוצה לו אין צולין את הפסח לא על השפוד ולא על האסכלא א"ר צדוק מעשה בר"ג שאמר לטבי עבדו צא וצלה לנו את הפסח על האסכלא:

<big><b>MISHNAH: </b></big>HOW IS THE PASSOVER-OFFERING ROASTED? WE BRING A SPIT OR POMEGRANATE WOOD AND THRUST IT INTO ITS MOUTH [RIGHT DOWN] AS FAR AS ITS BUTTOCKS, AND PLACE ITS KNEES AND ITS ENTRAILS INSIDE IT: THIS IS THE VIEW OF R'JOSE THE GALILEAN. R'AKIBA SAID: THIS IS IN THE NATURE OR SEETHING;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The entrails inside the animal are like meat in a pot, which is seething, not roasting.');">¹</span>

<big><strong>גמ׳</strong></big> וניתי של מתכת איידי דחם מקצתו חם כולו וקמטוי מחמת השפוד ורחמנא אמר (שמות יב, ח) צלי אש ולא צלי מחמת דבר אחר וניתי של דקל איידי דאית ליה שיבי מפיק מיא והוי כמבושל וניתי של תאנה איידי דמחלחל מפיק מיא והוה ליה כמבושל

BUT THEY ARE HUNG OUTSIDE IT. ONE MAY NOT ROAST THE PASSOVER-OFFERING EITHER ON A [METAL] SPIT OR ON A GRILL.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' This is explained in the GEMARA:');">²</span> R'ZADOK SAID: IT ONCE HAPPENED THAT R'GAMALIEL SAID TO HIS SERVANT TABI, GO OUT AND ROAST US THE PASSOVER-OFFERING ON THE GRILL.'

וניתי של אלון של חרוב ושל שקמה איידי דאית ביה קיטרי מפיק מיא

<big><b>GEMARA: </b></big>But let us bring [a spit] of metal? - When part of it is hot the whole of it is hot,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Metal-iron - being a good conductor of heat.');">³</span> and so [part of] it is roasted through the spit,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The flesh actually in contact with it is roasted in the heat of the spit, not by the heat of the fire.');">⁴</span> whereas the Divine Law saith, roast with fire,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Ex. XII,8.');">⁵</span>

של רמון נמי אית ביה קיטרי שיעי קיטרי ואבע"א בנבגא בר שתא דלית ביה קיטרי והא איכא בי פסקיה דמפיק לבי פסקיה לבר

and not roast through something else. But let us bring [a spit] of palm wood? - Since it has grooves it exudes water [sap], so that it would be like boiled. Then let us bring [a spit] of fig wood? - Since it is hollow,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Having a marrow-like substance inside.');">⁶</span>

מתני' דלא כרבי יהודה דתניא רבי יהודה אומר כשם ששפוד של עץ אינו נשרף כך שפוד של מתכת אינו מרתיח אמרו לו זה חם מקצתו חם כולו וזה חם מקצתו אינו חם כולו:

it exudes water, so that it is like boiled. Then let us bring [a spit] of the oak tree, the carob tree or the sycamore tree? - Because it has knots it exudes water. [But the wood] of the pomegranate tree too has knots? - Its knots are smooth.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Hence they do not exude sap.');">⁷</span>

ונותן את כרעיו וכו': תניא רבי ישמעאל קוריהו תוך תוך ר"ט קוריהו גדי מקולס

Alternatively, this refers to a shoot of this [i.e., the first] year's growth, which has no knots. But there is point where it is cut?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Which naturally exudes moisture.');">⁸</span> - He causes the point where it is cut to protrude without [the animal].

ת"ר איזהו גדי מקולס דאסור לאכול בלילי פסח בזמן הזה כל שצלאו כולו כאחד נחתך ממנו אבר נשלק ממנו אבר אין זה גדי מקולס

Our Mishnah is not according to R'Judah. For it was taught, R'Judah said: Just as a wooden spit is not burnt,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For being inside the lamb it is protected from the fire.');">⁹</span> so a metal spit does not boil [the flesh].<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Thus he permits the use of a metal spit.');">¹⁰</span>

השתא יש לומר נחתך ממנו אבר דאף על גב דקא מטוי ליה בהדיה אמרת לא נשלק מיבעיא א"ר ששת ששלקו במחובר

Said they to him: This [sc. metal], if part of it is hot, t whole of it is hot; whereas the other [wood], if part of it is hot, the whole of it is not hot.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Hence there is no analogy between the two.');">¹¹</span> AND WE PLACE ITS KNEES, etc. It was taught: R'Ishmael called it tok tok.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' 'Tok' is the sound of boiling. Thus he held that the knees etc. are placed inside it, so that it emits a sound of boiling. MS. M. reads: R. trcf, Ishmael called it a takbera i.e., a basket, as the animal was stuffed with the loose pieces, v. Jast. s.v. .');">¹²</span> R'Tarfon called it a helmeted goat.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' He held that the knees etc. must hang outside, so that it looked like a helmet on the head of a warrior.');">¹³</span>

אמר רבה האי מולייתא שריא א"ל אביי והא קא בלע דמא א"ל כבולעה כך פולטה

Our Rabbis taught: What is the helmeted goat which it is nowadays forbidden to eat on the nights of Passover?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., after the destruction of the Temple; v. supra 53a.');">¹⁴</span> Wherever the whole is roasted in one [piece]. If a lamb was cut from it, [or] if a limb of it was boiled, that is not a helmeted goat.

נימא מסייע ליה נותן את כרעיו ואת בני מעיו לתוכו מ"ט לאו משום דאמרינן כבולעו כך פולטו אמרי שאני התם כיון דאיכא בית השחיטה דמחלחל

Now that you say that if a limb was cut from it, even if he roasted it together with it, it is not [a helmeted goat], [if a limb is] boiled need it [be stated]?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Surely it is superfluous.');">¹⁵</span> - Said R'Shesheth: It means that he boiled it while attached [to the whole animal]. Rabbah said: A stuffed [lamb]<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., the lamb being stuffed with meat salted only enough for roasting, which is less than is required by law when it is to be boiled (Rashi) . Blood in flesh is forbidden, hence the prescribed, process of soaking and salting in order to draw it out.');">¹⁶</span> is permitted. Said Abaye to him: But [the lamb] absorbs the blood?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Which exudes from the pieces of meat with which it is stuffed when the whole is roasted.');">¹⁷</span> As it absorbs, so it exudes, he answered him.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' It exudes on the outside the same amount of blood which it first absorbs on the inside.');">¹⁸</span> Shall we say that this supports him: AND [WE] PLACE ITS KNEES AND ITS ENTRAILS INSIDE IT: what is the reason? Is it not because we say, as it absorbs, so it exudes? - I will tell you: it is different there, [for] since there is the place of slaughtering, which is hollo