Chullin 105

Chapter 105

א יש דרוסה לחתול או אין דרוסה לחתול

1 Is the clawing by a cat of consequence1

ב א"ל

2 or not? - He replied: Even the clawing by a weasel is of consequence.

ג אף לחולדה יש דרוסה

3 And is the clawing by a weasel of consequence or not? - He replied.

ד יש דרוסה לחולדה או אין דרוסה לחולדה

4 Even the clawing by a cat is of no consequence.

ה א"ל

5 And is the clawing by a cat or by a weasel of consequence or not? - He replied: The clawing by a cat is of consequence but the clawing by a weasel is not.

ו אף לחתול אין דרוסה

6 Now there is really no contradiction between these replies.

ז לחתול ולחולדה יש להן דרוסה או אין להן דרוסה

7 For when he said: 'Even the clawing by a weasel is of consequence', he meant with reference to birds; and when he said: 'Even the clawing by a cat is of no consequence', he meant with reference to large sheep; and when he said: 'The clawing by a cat is of consequence but the clawing by a weasel is not', he meant with reference to kids and lambs.

ח א"ל

8 R'Ashi asked: Is the clawing by the other2

ט לחתול יש דרוסה לחולדה אין דרוסה

9 unclean birds of consequence or not? - R'Hillel said to R'Ashi: When we were at the school of R'Kahana he taught us that the clawing by the other unclean birds was of consequence.

י ול"ק הא דא"ל

10 But have we not learnt: SMALL FOWL IF CLAWED BY A HAWK?3

יא אף לחולדה יש דרוסה בעופות

11 - It means, the clawing by a hawk is of consequence upon other [birds even as large] as itself, while the clawing by other birds is of consequence only upon others smaller than themselves.

יב הא דא"ל

12 Others say that it means, the clawing by a hawk is of consequence upon others even larger than itself, while the clawing by other birds is of consequence only upon others as large as themselves.

יג אף לחתול אין דרוסה באימרי רברבי

13 R'Kahana said in the name of R'Shimi B'Ashi: The clawing by a fox is of no consequence.

יד הא דא"ל

14 But this is not so?

טו לחתול יש דרוסה לחולדה אין דרוסה בגדיים וטלאים

15 For when R'Dimi came [from palestine] he related that there once happened a case where a ewe-lamb was clawed by a fox at the baths of Beth Hini,4

טז בעי רב אשי

16 and when the case was brought to the Sages they ruled that the clawing was of consequence! - R'Safra answered: In that case it must have been a cat [and not a fox].

יז שאר עופות טמאין יש להן דרוסה או אין להן דרוסה

17 Others report it thus: R'Kahana said in the name of R'Shimi B'Ashi, The clawing by a fox is of consequence.

יח א"ל רב הלל לרב אשי

18 But this is not so?

יט כי הוינן בי רב כהנא אמר

19 For when R'Dimi came [from Palestine] he related that there once happened a case where a ewe-lamb was clawed by a fox, and when the case was brought to the Sages they ruled that the clawing was of no consequence! - R'Safra answered: It must have been a dog [and not a fox].

כ שאר עופות טמאין יש להן דרוסה

20 R'Joseph said: We have it on tradition that the clawing by a dog is of no consequence.

כא והאנן תנן

21 Abaye said: We have it on tradition that clawing is only with the fore-leg, thus excluding the hind leg; tha clawing is only with the claws, thus excluding the teeth; that the clawing must be intentional, thus excluding an unintentional act;5

כב ודרוסת הנץ בעוף הדק

22 and that the clawing must be by a living animal, thus excluding the clawing by a dead animal.6

כג דרוסת הנץ בדכוותיה ואינך בדזוטרא מינייהו

23 But since you have already said it must not be unintentional, is it then at all necessary to say that must not be by a dead animal? - It is indeed necessary for the case where the animal struck with its claw and it was immediately amputated.

כד ואיכא דאמרי

24 Now you might have thought that it discharges the poison at once when it strikes with the claw, we therefore learn that it discharges the poison only when it withdraws the claw.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' So that if the claw had been amputated before it had been withdrawn from the victim, the latter is not trefah, for at the time when the poison is discharged the limb was already dead.');">7

כה דרוסת הנץ בדרבי מיניה ואינך בדכוותייהו

25 Rabbah son of R'Huna said in the name of Rab: If a lion had entered amidst oxen and later there was found a nail [from a lion's claw] lodged in the back of one of them, there is no fear that the lion had clawed it.

כו אמר רב כהנא משמיה דרב שימי בר אשי

26 Why?

כז אין דרוסה לשועל

27 Because although most lions attack with their claws there are a few that do not; moreover, all that do claw do not usually lose a nail, therefore the fact that this ox has a nail lodged in its back suggests that had rubbed itself against a wall.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' It is so rare an occurrence for a lion to lose a nail while attacking with its claw, that it is much more probable to suggest that the animal got the nail lodged in its back from having scratched itself against a wall in which this nail protruded.');">8

כח איני

28 On the contrary, we should argue thus: Although most oxen rub themselves against a wall there are a few that do not; moreover, all that do rub themselves against a wall do not usually find a nail lodged in their backs, therefore the fact that this ox has a nail lodged in its back suggests that it was clawed by a lion! - One can argue this way and one can argue that way; therefore as there is a doubt whether [the ox] had been clawed or not<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In the current ed. there are added the words: 'We must place it on its former status'. These words are omitted in MS.M., and are evidently redundant. V., however, Glosses of Samuel Strashun.');">9

כט והא כי אתא רב דימי אמר

29 [it is permitted, for] Rab is consistent in his vie that we are in no way apprehensive of an animal about which there is a doubt whether it has been clawed or not.

ל מעשה ודרס שועל רחל במרחץ של בית היני ובא מעשה לפני חכמים ואמרו

30 Abaye said: This is the rule only when the nail was actually there [protruding from the back of the ox], but if there was found the mark of the nail [of a claw upon the back], we are certainly apprehensive about it.

לא יש דרוסה

31 And even when the nail was actually there this rule10

לב אמר רב ספרא

32 applies only if the nail was moist [with blood], but if was dry it is quite usual for it to fall loose.11

לג ההיא חתול הוה

33 And even when the nail was moist the rule applies only to a single nail, but if there were two or three nails [upon the back of the animal] we are apprehensive about it; provided, however, they were in the shape of a paw.

לד איכא דאמרי אמר רב כהנא משמיה דרב שימי בר אשי

34 It was stated: Rab says: We are in no way apprehensive of fan animal] about which there is a doubt whether it has been clawed or not; Samuel says.

לה יש דרוסה לשועל

35 We are apprehensive about it.12

לו איני

36 Now all agree as to the following: if there was a doubt whether it [the lion] entered [among the cattle] or not, we may assume that it did not enter.

לז והא כי אתא רב דימי אמר

37 If there was a doubt whether [an animal had been clawed] by a dog or by a cat, we may assume that it was a dog.13

לח מעשה ודרס שועל רחל במרחץ של בית היני ובא מעשה לפני חכמים ואמרו

38 If it [the lion] entered, and quietly lay down among the cattle, we may assume that it became friendly with them.

לט אין דרוסה

39 If it broke the head of one, we may assume that its fury has thereby been assuaged.14

מ אמר רב ספרא

40 If the lion was roaring and the cattle were lowing, we may assume that they are trying to frighten

מא ההוא כלב הוה

מב אמר רב יוסף

מג נקטינן אין דרוסה לכלב

מד אמר אביי נקטינן

מה אין דרוסה אלא ביד לאפוקי רגל דלא

מו אין דרוסה אלא בצפורן לאפוקי שן דלא

מז אין דרוסה אלא מדעת לאפוקי שלא מדעת דלא

מח אין דרוסה אלא מחיים לאפוקי לאחר מיתה דלא

מט אמרי

נ השתא שלא מדעת אמרת לא לאחר מיתה מיבעיא

נא לא צריכא דדריס ופסקוה לידיה

נב מהו דתימא בהדי דדריס שדי זיהריה קמ"ל

נג בהדי דשליף שדי זיהריה

נד אמר רבה בר רב הונא אמר רב

נה ארי שנכנס לבין השוורים ונמצא צפורן בגבו של אחד מהן אין חוששין שמא ארי דרסו

נו מאי טעמא

נז רוב אריות דורסין ומיעוטן אין דורסין וכל הדורס אין צפרנו נשמטת

נח וזאת הואיל וצפורן יושבת לו בגבו אימר בכותל נתחכך

נט אדרבה

ס רוב שוורים מתחככין ומיעוטן אין מתחככין וכל המתחכך אין צפורן יושבת לו בגבו

סא וזה הואיל וצפורן יושבת לו בגבו אימר ארי דרסו

סב איכא למימר הכי ואיכא למימר הכי אוקי מילתא אחזקיה הו"ל ספק דרוסה

סג ורב לטעמיה דאמר

סד אין חוששין לספק דרוסה

סה אמר אביי

סו לא אמרן אלא צפורן אבל מקום צפורן חוששין

סז וצפורן נמי לא אמרן אלא לחה אבל יבשה עבדה דמשתמטא

סח ולחה נמי לא אמרן אלא חדא אבל תרתי ותלת חיישינן והוא דקיימא בדרא דסיחופיה

סט איתמר רב אמר

ע אין חוששין לספק דרוסה ושמואל אמר

עא חוששין לספק דרוסה

עב דכולי עלמא

עג ספק על ספק לא על אימא לא על

עד ספק כלבא ספק שונרא אימא כלבא

עה על שתיק ואיתוב בינייהו אימר שלמא שוי

עו קטע רישיה דחד מינייהו נח מריתחיה

עז איהו קא מעואי ואינהו קמקרקרן בעותי קא מבעתי

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