Chullin 146

Chapter 146

א בשלמא לרבי שמעון בן לקיש לדבריהם קאמר להו

1 Now this is all well according to R'Simeon B'Lakish, for then he [R'Meir] would be arguing from their point of view.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' R. Meir contends that even if his opponents' view, namely, that the slaughtering of the animal renders the limb that hangs loose clean, were right (which he does not admit) , the conclusion drawn from it cannot be sustained.');">1

ב לדידי לא שנא אבר דעובר ולא שנא אבר דבהמה כי הדדי נינהו

2 For according to my view, [says R'Meir] there is no difference between the limb of the foetus and the loose limb of the animal; they are both alike.

ג אלא לרבי יוחנן קשיא

3 But according to R'Johanan this is a difficulty!<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The statement of R. Johanan, namely, that it is agreed by all that the limb that hangs loose is not rendered clean by the slaughtering, is clearly contradicted by the passage quoted.');">2

ד אלא אי אתמר הכי אתמר

4 - We must therefore say that if [the dispute was] reported it was reported as follows: R'Simeon B'Lakish said: Just as they differ with regard to the [limb of the] foetus so they differ with regard to loose limbs.

ה אמר רבי שמעון בן לקיש כמחלוקת בעוברים כך מחלוקת באיברין

5 R'Johana said: They differ only with regard to the limb of the foetus, but with regard to the loose limb of the animal all agree that at the slaughtering it is not accounted as detached.3

ו ורבי יוחנן אמר

6 R'Jose B'Hanina said: What reason does R'Johanan suggest for R'Meir's view? - One4

ז מחלוקת באבר דעובר אבל באבר דבהמה ד"ה אין שחיטה עושה ניפול

7 is part of the animal but the other is not.

ח א"ר יוסי בר' חנינא

8 R'Isaac B'Joseph said in the name of R'Johanan, All agree that at death [the limb] is accounted as detached,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' If a limb was hanging loose from an animal and the animal died, this limb is not regarded unclean as nebelah i.e., as part of the carcass, but rather unclean as a limb that had been detached from a living animal. And the difference between the two is this: a portion of nebelah the size of an olive will render unclean, whereas a portion severed from a limb that had become detached from a living animal will not, for only when the limb is complete in its entirely with flesh, bones and veins, will it render unclean, and not otherwise.');">5

ט מ"ט דרבי יוחנן אליבא דר"מ

9 and that at the slaughtering it is not accounted as detached.

י האי גופה והאי לאו גופה

10 What is [the subject that is] spoken of?

יא אמר רב יצחק בר יוסף א"ר יוחנן

11 If you say the limb of the foetus, surely there is a difference of opinion with regard to it!6

יב הכל מודים שמיתה עושה ניפול ואין שחיטה עושה ניפול

12 And if you say the loose limb of the animal, but we have already learnt it both of death and also of slaughtering! We have learnt it of death [in the following Mishnah]: If the animal died, the flesh [that was hanging loose] must be made susceptible [to contract uncleanness],7

יג במאי עסקינן

13 but the limb [that was hanging loose] conveys uncleanness as the limb of a living animal and not as the limb of a dead animal [nebelah]:<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Thus proving that at death the limb is accounted as detached since it is regarded as the limb of a living animal. It will, accordingly, only convey uncleanness when complete; v. supra n 2.');">8

יד אילימא באבר דעובר מיפלג פליגי

14 so R'Meir.9

טו אלא באבר דבהמה מיתה תנינא שחיטה תנינא

15 We have also learnt it of slaughtering [in the following Mishnah]: If the animal was slaughtered, they<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., the flesh and the limb that were hanging loose from the animal. The fact that they require to be rendered susceptible to uncleanness clearly proves that they are themselves clean by reason of the slaughtering, hence it is evident that at the slaughtering the loose flesh and limbs are not considered detached.');">10

טז מיתה תנינא מתה הבהמה הבשר צריך הכשר והאבר מטמא משום אבר מן החי ואינו מטמא משום אבר מן הנבלה דברי ר' מאיר

16 have been rendered susceptible [to contract uncleanness] by the blood: so R'Meir.

יז שחיטה נמי תנינא

17 R'Simeon says: They have not been rendered susceptible [to contract uncleanness]!9

יח נשחטה בהמה הוכשרו בדמיה דברי ר"מ

18 - From this [last Mishnah] I might have thought that 'rendered susceptible' referred only to the [loose] flesh.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' But not to a complete limb that was hanging loose. In the latter case it might be held by R. Meir that the limb is itself a source of uncleanness, and as such does not require to be rendered susceptible by moistening, inasmuch as at the slaughtering it was accounted as detached; it was therefore necessary for R. Johanan to teach that all agree that the limb is itself clean, for at the slaughtering the limb is not accounted as detached.');">11

יט ר"ש אומר

19 But does it not say: 'They have been rendered susceptible'?12

כ לא הוכשרו

20 - It might have been thought [that 'they' refers to] flesh that hangs loose from the animal and also to flesh that is severed from the limb.13

כא אי מההיא ה"א

21 And why is one more certain than the other?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Why was it necessary for the Tanna to refer expressly to flesh that was severed from a limb? In what way is it to be distinguished from flesh that hangs loose from the animal?');">14

כב מאי הוכשרו אבשר

22 - I might have argued that, since it conveys the graver uncleanness as long as it is with the whole [limb],15

כג והא הוכשרו קתני

23 it does not require to be rendered susceptible [to uncleanness].

כד מהו דתימא

24 We are therefore taught [that it does].<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For once the flesh has been severed from the limb it can no more convey the graver uncleanness; consequently it must be rendered susceptible to uncleanness in accordance with the principle laid down in Nid. 51a, and infra 121a.');">16

כה חד לבשר הפורש מן הבהמה וחד לבשר הפורש מן האבר

25 R'Joseph said: Hold fast to the ruling of R'Isaac B'Joseph,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' That all agree that at the slaughtering the limb is not accounted as detached; in other words the slaughtering of the animal has an effect upon the loose limb, even to the extent of rendering it permitted to be eaten.');">17

כו ומאי אולמיה דהאי מהאי

26 for Rabbah B'Bar Hana is in agreement with him.

כז סלקא דעתך אמינא

27 For it was taught: The verse: Ye shall not eat any flesh that is torn of beasts in the field,18

כח הואיל ומטמא טומאה חמורה אגב אביו אימא לא ליבעי הכשר קמשמע לן

28 includes [within its prohibition] any limb or flesh that hangs loose from cattle, wild beasts, or birds at the time of slaughtering.

כט אמר רב יוסף

29 But Rabbah B'Bar Hana added in the name of R'Johanan,

ל נקוט ' דרב יצחק בר יוסף בידך דרבה בר בר חנה קאי כוותיה דתניא

לא (שמות כב, ל) ובשר בשדה טרפה לא תאכלו להביא האבר והבשר המדולדלין בבהמה ובחיה ובעוף ושחטן שהן אסורין

לב ואמר רבה בר בר חנה א"ר יוחנן

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