Chullin 196

אין בשלה אלא שלימה

implies that it must be whole.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The inference from the word 'cooked' is obscure (Rashi) .');">¹</span>

ר' שמעון בן יוחאי אומר

R'Simeon B'Yohai says.'

אין בשלה אלא שנתבשלה עם האיל

Cooked' implies that it must have been cooked together with the ram.

דכולי עלמא

Now in fact both<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The first Tanna and R. Simeon b. Yohai.');">²</span>

בהדי איל מבשל לה מר סבר

agree that it must be cooked with the ram, but [they differ in the following]: one holds that it must first be cut away and then cooked,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The first Tanna maintains that the shoulder must be cut away from the ram and then cooked in the same pot as the ram. And the term 'whole' rn implies that the shoulder must in no wise be cut up in pieces. So Rashi; according to Tosaf. s.v. , this is the opinion of R. Simeon b. Yohai.');">³</span>

מחתך לה והדר מבשל לה ומר סבר

and the other holds that it must first b cooked and then cut away.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' R. Simeon b. Yohai maintains that the shoulder must be cut away only after the whole ram has been cooked. According to Tosaf. this is the opinion of the first Tanna.');">⁴</span>

מבשל לה והדר מחתך לה

Alternatively, I can say, all agree that it must first be cut away and then cooked but [they differ in this]: one<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' R. Simeon b. Yohai.');">⁵</span>

ואי בעית אימא דכ"ע מחתך לה והדר מבשל לה

holds that it must be cooked together with the ram [in the same pot], and the other holds that it must be cooked in a separate pot.

מיהו מר סבר

Now according to the first version from either view and according to the second version from the view of R'Simeon B'Yohai [can the required standard be derived].<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Either the sixty-fold or hundred-fold standard. It must be observed that in the case of the ram of the Nazirite sacrifice resort must be had to the principle of neutralization and it must be assumed that the essence and flavour of the shoulder, which is forbidden to all but priests, is nullified by the rest of the flesh of the ram, for otherwise the Nazirite, an Israelite, would not be allowed to partake of the flesh of the ram since it must be cooked together with the shoulder according to both views in the first version, or according to the view of R. Simeon b. Yohai in the second version.');">⁶</span>

בהדי איל מבשל לה ומר סבר

He who holds the sixty-fold standard maintains that the flesh and bone [of the shoulder] must be measured against the flesh and bone [of the ram], and the latter is sixty times as much as the former.

בקדרה אחרת מבשל לה

But he who holds the hundred-fold standard maintains that only the flesh [of the shoulder] must be measured against the flesh [of the ram] and the latter is a hundred times as much as the former.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For the shoulder consists in the greater part of bone and has but little flesh on it, and the Rabbis have estimated that if taken bulk for bulk the ram would be only sixty times as much as the shoulder, but if only the proportion of the flesh is considered it will be found that the ram is one hundred times as much as the flesh of the shoulder.');">⁷</span>

ללישנא קמא אליבא דדברי הכל ללישנא בתרא אליבא דרבי שמעון בן יוחאי

But can one derive the standard from the above?

מאן דאמר בששים סבר

Surely it has been taught: This<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Sc. the ram of the Nazirite sacrifice.');">⁸</span>

בשר ועצמות בהדי בשר ועצמות משערינן והוה ליה בששים

is a case of a substance being permitted even though it has absorbed a forbidden substance.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., the forbidden shoulder.');">⁹</span>

מאן דאמר במאה סבר

Now what does 'this' exclude?

בשר בהדי בשר משערינן והוה ליה במאה

Presumably it excludes every other substance which has absorbed any matter forbidden by the Torah?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., that neutralization does not take place. So that the principle of neutralization either in sixty-fold or in a hundred, fold cannot be derived from here.');">¹⁰</span>

ומי ילפינן מינה

- Abaye answered, [The exclusion] was necessary only according to R'Judah who maintains that [in all other cases] homogeneous substances cannot neutralize each other; hence we are taught that here they do neutralize each other.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Even though the shoulder and the rest of the ram are homogeneous substances. One can however derive from here the principle of neutralization with regard to heterogeneous substances.');">¹¹</span>

והתניא

But why does he not infer the rule from here?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Why does not R. Judah infer from the case of the ram of the Nazirite sacrifice that in all cases homogeneous substances can neutralize each other?');">¹²</span>

זהו היתר הבא מכלל איסור זהו למעוטי מאי לאו למעוטי כל איסורין שבתורה

- Because the Divine Law has expressly stated: And he shall take of the blood of the bullock and of the blood of the goat,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lev. XVI, 18. The blood of the goat, although mixed with the blood of the bullock and though considerably less in quantity than the blood of the bullock, nevertheless retains its identity and is not neutralized by the latter, obviously because they are homogeneous substances and cannot neutralize each other.');">¹³</span>

אמר אביי

which shows that though they are both [mixed up] together one does not neutralize the other.

לא נצרכא אלא לרבי יהודה דאמר

But why do you prefer to infer [the rule of non-neutralization of homogeneous substances] from this [verse] rather than from the other?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., from the case of the ram of the Nazirite sacrifice. The inference from this case would be that even homogeneous substances can neutralize each other.');">¹⁴</span>

מין במינו לא בטיל קמ"ל

Because that is an anomaly,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In that the Torah allows at the outset the neutralization of a forbidden substance, contrary to all Rabbinic dicta. V. Bez. 4b.');">¹⁵</span>

דהכא בטיל

and one cannot draw any inferences from an anomaly.

וליגמר מיניה

If so, how may we infer [the rule of neutralization] in hundredfold or in sixty-fold from it?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In respect of heterogeneous substances according to R. Judah, or in respect of all substances according to the Rabbis. V. supra p. 549, n. 5.');">¹⁶</span>

גלי רחמנא (ויקרא טז, יח) ולקח מדם הפר ומדם השעיר תרוייהו בהדי הדדי נינהו ולא בטלי

- Forsooth, do we infer leniency from it?

ומאי חזית דגמרי' מהאיך ליגמר מהאי

We infer a restriction, for according to the rule of the Torah a substance is neutralized in a bare majority [of other substances].<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' But for the inference from the ram of the Nazirite, we should have acted in accordance with the Biblical principle, 'Decide the issue according to the majority', based on Ex. XXIII, 2. One may infer conditions of stringency (namely, that there must be sixty times or a hundred times the quantity of the prohibited substance) even from an anomaly.');">¹⁷</span>

חדוש הוא ומחדוש לא גמרינן

Raba answered: [The exclusion]<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In the statement 'This is a case of a substance etc.'.');">¹⁸</span>

אי הכי למאה וס' נמי לא ליגמר

was necessary with reference to the rule that the taste<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Even though the taste is barely perceptible and is certainly less than one sixtieth or one hundredth part of the entire mixture. (Rashi, but see Tosaf. ad loc.) .');">¹⁹</span>

אטו אנן לקולא גמרינן לחומרא גמרינן דמדאורייתא ברובא בטיל

[of a forbidden substance] is [treated] as the substance itself.

רבא אמר

Now as this [sc. the taste] is forbidden in the case of consecrated matter, we are therefore taught that here<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Sc. in the case of the ram of the Nazirite sacrifice.');">²⁰</span>

לא נצרכא אלא לטעם כעיקר דבקדשים אסור קא משמע לן דהכא שרי

it is permitted.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Likewise with regard to unconsecrated matter the taste is neutralized either in sixty-fold or in hundred-fold.');">²¹</span>