Menachot 175

את מי אביא תחתיו אלא מדה יתירה של לוג ומחצה היתה שם שבו היה מודד לחביתי כהן גדול לוג ומחצה בבקר לוג ומחצה בין הערבים

What then can I put in its place?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' To make up the seven liquid-measures.');">¹</span>

אמרו לו חצי לוג היתה שם ואפשר לשער בחצי לוג

But there was an additional measure there of a log and a half, by which one used to measure [the oil] for the griddle-cakes of the High Priest, a log and a half in the morning and a log and a half towards evening.

אמר להם אף לדבריכם [חצי לוג] ולוג לא יעשה רביעית היתה שם ואפשר לשער ברביעית אלא זה הכלל היה במקדש כלי שמשמש מדה זו אינו משמש מדה אחרת:

They said to him, But there was there the half-log measure, and one could therefore measure it<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The log and a half of oil.');">²</span>

ר' אלעזר בר' צדוק אומר שנתות היו בהין וכו':

with the half-log measure! He replied, In that case, even according to your view, there was no need for the half-log measure, for since there was there the quarter-log measure it was possible to measure it with the quarter-log! But the following rule was established in the Temple: The vessel that served for one measure did not serve for another measure.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' It was thus not permissible to measure a half-log by filling twice the quarter-log measure, similarly to measure a log and a half by filling the half-log measure three times.');">³</span>

מאי איכא בין רבי מאיר לרבי יהודה אמר ר' יוחנן בירוצי מדות איכא בינייהו

R'Eliezer B'R'Zadok says, There were markings in the hin measure [indicating] thus far for a bullock, thus far for a ram, and thus far for a lamb.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' This is the continuation of the Baraitha, and not the quotation from our Mishnah, v. Rashi.');">⁴</span>

למאן דאמר ממטה למעלה קסבר בירוצי המדות נתקדשו ורביעית יהיב ליה רחמנא למשה ואמר ליה שער דקא עיילי להו בירוצין

What is the difference between R'Meir and R'Judah? - R'Johanan said, There is a difference between them as regards the overflow of the measures.

למאן דאמר ממעלה למטה קסבר בירוצי מדות לא נתקדשו והין יהיב ליה רחמנא למשה ואמר ליה שער בהא דקא נפקי בירוצין

He who counts the measures from below upwards<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Sc. R. Judah, who enumerates the measures beginning from the smallest, the quarter-log.');">⁵</span>

אביי אמר דכולי עלמא בירוצי המדות איכא למימר נתקדשו ואיכא למימר לא נתקדשו והכא במלאים קא מיפלגי

is of the opinion that the overflow of the measures was also holy; for the All-Merciful gave unto Moses a quarter-log measure and instructed him to calculate [the larger measures] by including the overflow [of the smaller measure].<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For when the smaller measuring vessel is filled to overflowing and is quickly poured out into 'the larger vessel the latter vessel will take in also the overflow of the former. Accordingly the half-log measure was a little more than two full quarter-logs since it held the two quarter-logs plus the overflow of each. And so also with the larger measures.');">⁶</span>

מאן דאמר מלמעלה למטה קא סבר מלאים שלא יחסר ושלא יותיר

But he who counts the measures from the top downwards<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Sc. R. Meir, who enumerates the measures beginning with the largest, the hin.');">⁷</span>

ומאן דאמר ממטה למעלה מלאים שלא יחסר אבל יותיר מלאים קרינא ביה

is of the opinion that the overflow of the measures was not holy; for the All-Merciful gave unto Moses a hin measure and instructed him to calculate [the smaller measures] by excluding the overflow [of the larger measure].<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For when pouring from a larger vessel which is filled to overflowing into two smaller vessels, by the time the smaller vessels are filled the overflow of the larger will have run off. Hence the several measures were exact measures without the overflow.');">⁸</span>

אמר מר רבי שמעון אומר לא היה שם הין שפיר קאמר להו רבי שמעון לרבנן ורבנן הוה הין דעבד משה לשמן המשחה דכתיב (שמות ל, כד) ושמן זית הין

Abaye said, All [may be of the opinion] that the overflow of the measures was either holy or not holy, but they differ as to the meaning of the word 'full'.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Stated in Num. VII, 13 in regard to the measures.');">⁹</span>

מר סבר כיון דלדורות לא הוה צריך לפי שעה הוא דעבדיה ואיגנז ואידך כיון דהוה הוה

He who counts the measures from the top downwards maintains that the word 'full' implies that it may be neither less [than the prescribed measure] nor more.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Accordingly all the measures had to be determined with accuracy, and this could only be done by filling the largest measure, the hin, to the brim and carefully dividing it into halves and into quarters etc. Conversely, to fill the smaller vessel several times and pour it into the larger vessel would not give an accurate measure, for two full half-measures when poured into a larger vessel are more than one whole measure (Rashi MS.) .');">¹⁰</span>

אמר מר ואת מי אביא תחתיו לא סגיא דלא מעייל כדאמר רבינא גמירי שתי סמיכות בציבור הכא נמי גמירי דשבע מדות של לח היו במקדש

But he who counts the measures from below upwards maintains that the word 'full' implies that it may not be less [than the prescribed measure], but if it is more it is still regarded as 'full'.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since the measures were calculated from the smallest they were a little more than the measure they represented; thus the half-log was a little more than two exact quarter-logs, for when pouring two quarter-logs into a large vessel there would be therein more than a half-log by reason of itnu the froth that is formed (Rashi MS.) . Tosaf. s.v. suggest the following interesting interpretation: It is agreed that the term 'full' precludes what is less than the prescribed measure, but as to what is more, he who maintains that the largest measure was given to Moses and was divided up into smaller measures, takes this as a symbol to exclude anything that is more than the measure, but he who maintains that the smallest measure was given to Moses and by increasing it the other measures were arrived at, takes it as a symbol that even what is more than the measure is still regarded as the full measure.');">¹¹</span>

ר' אלעזר בר' צדוק אומר שנתות היו בהין ולית ליה שבע מדות לית ליה ואי בעית אימא מאי שבע מדות שבע מדידות:

The Master said, R'Simeon says, There was no hin measure there at all'.

<big><strong>מתני׳</strong></big> רביעית מה היתה משמשת רביעית מים למצורע ורביעית שמן לנזיר

R'Simeon is surely quite right in his argument with the Rabbis.

חצי לוג מה היה משמש חצי לוג מים לסוטה וחצי לוג שמן לתודה

What can the Rabbis reply? - There was the hin measure used by Moses in the preparation of the anointing oil, as it is written, And of olive oil a hin.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Ex. XXX, 24.');">¹²</span>

ובלוג היה מודד לכל המנחות

Now one is of the opinion that since it was not necessary for later generations, it was only made for that occasion and thereafter hidden away, but the other is of the opinion that once it was put to a use it remained as a measure.

אפילו מנחה של ס' עשרון נותן לה ס' לוג ר' אליעזר בן יעקב אומר אפילו מנחה של ס' עשרון אין לה אלא לוגה שנאמר (ויקרא יד, כא) למנחה ולוג שמן \

The Master said, 'What then can I put in its place? ' But is it absolutely essential to substitute another?

ששה לפר וארבעה לאיל ושלשה לכבש

A Rabina said elsewhere: There is a tradition that among the offerings of the congregation only two require the laying on of hands;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Supra 62b.');">¹³</span>

שלשה ומחצה למנורה חצי לוג לכל נר:

similarly here there is a tradition that there were seven liquid-measures in the Temple.

<big><strong>גמ׳</strong></big> יתיב רבי וקא קשיא ליה רביעית למה נמשחה אי מצורע

R'ELIEZER SON OF R'ZADOK SAYS, THERE WERE MARKINGS IN THE HIN MEASURE. Does he not then accept the tradition of seven liquid-measures? - He does not. Alternatively I can say, By seven measures he understood seven measurings.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., seven markings in the hin measure.');">¹⁴</span> <big><b>MISHNAH: </b></big>FOR WHAT PURPOSE DID THE QUARTER-LOG SERVE? [TO MEASURE] A QUARTER-LOG OF WATER FOR THE LEPER<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Cf. Lev. XIV, 5. One of the birds used in the purification rites of the leper was to be killed over running water in an earthen vessel. The quantity of water was determined by the Rabbis at one quarter-log, for in this quantity the blood of the bird would still be recognizable. V. Sot. 16b.');">¹⁵</span> AND A QUARTER-LOG OF OIL FOR THE NAZIRITE.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For his cakes and wafers; v. Num. VI, 15.');">¹⁶</span> FOR WHAT PURPOSE DID THE HALF-LOG SERVE? [TO MEASURE] A HALF-LOG OF WATER FOR THE SUSPECTED WOMAN<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In the preparation of the bitter waters; cf. ibid. V, 17 and Sot. 15b.');">¹⁷</span> AND A HALF-LOG OF OIL FOR THE THANK-OFFERING. WITH THE LOG ONE MEASURED [THE OIL] FOR ALL THE MEAL-OFFERINGS. EVEN A MEAL-OFFERING OF SIXTY TENTHS<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' This was the maximum quantity of flour that might be brought as a meal-offering in a single vessel. Infra 103b.');">¹⁸</span> REQUIRED SIXTY LOGS [OF OIL]. R'ELIEZER B. JACOB SAYS, EVEN A MEAL-OFFERING OF SIXTY TENTHS REQUIRED ONLY ONE LOG [OF OIL], FOR IT IS WRITTEN, FOR A MEAL-OFFERING, AND A LOG OF OIL.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lev. XIV, 21. Thus no matter how large the meal-offering was only one log of oil was necessary.');">¹⁹</span> SIX [LOGS]<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Of oil and of wine, measured by the half-hin measure. The hin comprised twelve logs.');">²⁰</span> WERE REQUIRED FOR A BULLOCK. FOUR<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Measured by the third-hin measure.');">²¹</span> FOR A RAM, AND THREE<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Measured by the quarter-hin measure.');">²²</span> FOR A LAMB; THREE LOGS AND A HALF FOR THE CANDLESTICK, A HALF-LOG FOR EACH LAMP. <big><b>GEMARA: </b></big>Rabbi was sitting and raised this difficulty: Wherefore was the quarter-log measure anointed?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' All the Temple measures were anointed with the anointing oil and thereby consecrated, so that they could hallow whatever was put in them.');">²³</span> If [it was in order to hallow the quarter-log of water] of the leper,